Looking for a Basic Fip-Flop Circuit

[Greek Reef]

Hi all,

I am looking for a basic solid state circuit (without a noisy relay) that will allow me to switch (flip-flop) the 230V power input, between two different outputs continuosly.
ie: Get 230V input and give the entire 230V to the 1st output for 1 min, and then switch the 230V output to the 2nd output, and so on. A continuous flip-flop.

The 1 min is a random period I selected for the example, but it would be great if I could adjust it at will (from 20 sec to several minutes, 15 lets say) and also to introduce a delay when switching between the two outlets.

Is there an electronic wizard amongst all us DIYers that will lend me a hand?

 

[DonW]

Sound like your still working on a 230v wave timer set-up. What voltage are the powerheads that your attempting control. Are they US just running on the higher voltage 110/230? Are you doing this diy to save $$ or just cant find one rated for 230?
Let me know, I have a few ideas.

Don

 

[dnjan]

All that starting sounds like a good way to burn out a pump motor ...

Similar (end result) question - does anybody know of external DC pumps that could be controlled by a Tunze (type) controller? I was thinking more like ramping up and down rather than on and off.

 

[DonW]

All that starting sounds like a good way to burn out a pump motor ...

I think he's just working on a wave maker. Since he is in greece (230v)there are no wavemakers to purchase outright.

Don

 

[DonW]

If you dont mind a little soldering this is a quick easy cheap way to get a 230v wavemaker.

 

[Greek Reef]

Oups... that what I get for being 7-10 hrs ahead of everyone. As I get ready to hit the sack, you guys are full force at it!... :lol:

Thanks for all the responses!

DonW, yep you got me, it is a cheap DIY wavemaker I am aiming for. I am starting with Maxi Jets since they are the most rugged PH I've used, they are cheap and I can even get used cheaper for testing out things.
The schematic you put up is assuming a relay controlled by 110V, but switching 230V? Although I would want to stay away from clonky relays and go solid state, it is a possibility, can you verify?

dnjan I've punished MaxiJets over the years, in many more ways than I thought I could, and they do not want to quit on me (other than one -out of many- worn out shaft) so I wouldn't worry so much about the PH. Its the relay contacts I usually worry about.

Since I posted here I came across this one at OZReef and send a few emails to get details.
http://ozreef.org/content/view/121/29/

 

[DonW]

Most decent relays you will not be able to hear unless you are dealing with the big high amp ones. Do you have special 230v maxijets? If not you, just need a power converter. By the time you buy all the components and setup like a 555 timer circut youll have more $ invested than just converting the power.

Don

 

[Greek Reef]

Yup I get 230V Maxi-Jets. Actually all my pumps are 230V, for us, the 110V ones are considered 'special'

Actually once I set this diy wavemaker up properly, I will plug two New-Jets 2300 on it, and get the Maxi-Jets a Turbelle Stream-like DIY mod with props etc...
The New-Jets are 38Watts, and the Maxi-Jets are even lower, so nothing too heavy for a normal relay I assume.

DonW, u know where I can get a wirring diagram for what you propose?

 

[DonW]

Man, I just thought that up this morning. I'll have to draw something up for you.

Don

 

[dnjan]

I agree - maxijets are nearly indestructable. I was afraid you were trying to do rapid switiching on other pumps.

 

[DonW]

Here's a better idea:
go to canakits.com
buy: cyclytic timer
reset timer
Then find a 12/220v dpdt relay. Use the relay to fire pumps in pairs. You connect the reset timer to a spst relay to kill the input to the dpdt relay. This is your feeding timer.

Make sense?

Don

 

[Greek Reef]

Well, I must admit that what you wrote (dpdt relay,spst relay etc) went waaaay over my head so I spend some serious time on Google today! :badgrin:

Taking a crack at what you said, and running the risk of turning this thread into Electrics 101:
The cyclic timer will the low-voltage (9-12V) part of the relay, which in turn will cause the relay to activate the 230V side, and power the pump with the frequency and the duration that the cyclic timer will 'dictate'.

Doing so, I need one cyclic timer and one relay for each pump.

Is there a relay that would switch between its two outputs every time the cyclic timer would 'cycle'?

Is that what I would achieve with a SPDT relay instead of the DPDT?

 

[DonW]

Well, I must admit that what you wrote (dpdt relay,spst relay etc) went waaaay over my head so I spend some serious time on Google today! :badgrin:

Taking a crack at what you said, and running the risk of turning this thread into Electrics 101:
The cyclic timer will the low-voltage (9-12V) part of the relay, which in turn will cause the relay to activate the 230V side, and power the pump with the frequency and the duration that the cyclic timer will 'dictate'.

Doing so, I need one cyclic timer and one relay for each pump.

Is there a relay that would switch between its two outputs every time the cyclic timer would 'cycle'?

Is that what I would achieve with a SPDT relay instead of the DPDT?

No you only need one timer. Yes your dpdt relay is going to be no/nc. Meaning one side of the relay will be on when the other is off. This is how you get the alternating "flip-flop" and you can easily run two pumps on each side of the relay.
The reset timer does nothing more than cut the 230v supply for a specified period of time. Example: push the button and all pumps shut down for 5 minutes (feeding timer).
I'll try to draw a diagram in the next day or so. What I need to know is how your electricity is set up. Is it just a single leg of 230 and a neutral or is two legs of 115.

Don

 

[Greek Reef]

OK gotcha with the DPDT relay! Sweet set-up then...

Our power outlets use a single pair of cables that give us 220-230V single phase. There is a third cable for ground.Don't let the 230V confuse you, it's setup just like yours, just that it gives out double the voltage and slightly different frequency (50Hz).

 

[DonW]

OK gotcha with the DPDT relay! Sweet set-up then...

Our power outlets use a single pair of cables that give us 220-230V single phase. There is a third cable for ground.Don't let the 230V confuse you, it's setup just like yours, just that it gives out double the voltage and slightly different frequency (50Hz).

Just to clarify. You have one hot 230v, one neutral and one ground. It really only effects what relay gets used for the feeding timer.

Don

 

[DonW]

This will do it for you. Just to make things a bit easier, use the same relay for both.

Don

 

[Greek Reef]

Thanks for all the help Don. Now all that is left, is for you to make me a couple of those and send them to me :badgrin: :badgrin:

J/K... I think I have all the pieces now, and am looking into online shops to get the necessary parts (check your PM) so to get things rolling.

Will update here as project moves on...

 

[Scooterman]

I can get you the timer relay DPDT all in one nice unit, your main concern would be amperage, so give me that & I'll fine one you can order online. If you do insist on solid state your adding big cash for one considering the price for a timer relay. Also how many sets of contacts do you need?

http://www.ab.com/industrialcontrols/products/relays_timers_and_temp_controllers/solid-state_relays/solid_state_relay.html

 

[DonW]

Here is the Digikey pn# for the two relays. z181-nd 12v coil 5a@220v ony $5.38 ea. You need two of these. They do ship internationally. You can get it all in one neat package but I've never been able to find one for less than $200 for the recycle timer relays.

Don

 

[DonW]

Here is your cyclytic recycle time for $18.70
http://www.canakit.com/Contents/Items/UK191.asp

Don