Oceanic 60 gal design questions

[reef rider]

Thinking of purchasing a 60 gal Oceanic system.This system has the overflow and return inside the aquarium plumed through the floor of the aquarium.Not too crazy about the space the cover box takes up,but for the price,cheap,I can live with it.This runs to a Trickle filter model 75,smoked acrylic.Could I convert this filter to a refugium easily?Is clear acrylic a better choice?The system is about seven years old,but was kept very well.Planning on reef setup.Any drawback to this type of system?Guidance appreciated ,Thanks

 

[Frankie]

Hello and welcome to RF

Yeah, that is a good system to DIY (do it yourself) and start off with. Go for it if the price is right. I like the 60 gallon displays and am currently working on one right now.

Pictures will be very helpful in guiding you on how to convert it. Basically your going to use that first chamber empty and replace the bioballs with a filter sock. If I could get my eyes on the sump it would be easier to make suggestions.

Frank

 

[reef rider]

I have two pictures,but it is of the stand with doors open only showing the side ,the other showing the top.Not sure if I can upload photos that were e-maile to meor not sure how.When I saved them to my pics they were blank. Clicking on them I had to use windows pic gallery to view them.

 

[Frankie]

They should be saved in your windows pic gallery then. You could alway forward the email to me and I can upload them for you. [email protected] Give that a try.

Frank

 

[reef rider]

E-mailed the pics to you today. hope you recieved them.

 

[Frankie]

Hello reef rider,

That is a fine tank to start off with. I am sure we can do something with that sump. It's looks to be just a standard trickle system sump. It's hard to tell though with the smoked acrylic.
I bet it looks just like this inside

This one I had running on a frag tank I grew coral in. No skimmer or reactors. Just filter socks, weekly water changes, live rock, shallow sand and carbon. Worked great with a low fish load. Be sure to change carbon out monthly.


What are your plans for filtration? Have you looked into protein skimmers? Although not necessarily a must, they are very helpful in controlling nutrients.

You may consider ditching the sump altogether and building your own out of a 20 or 40 gallon fish tank. That's how I did it on my first reef tank, though I did things a bit different then everyone else from the beginning. I elevated my refugium and tossed out the idea of having mud or sand, instead filtering the water up through the macro algae preventing the gas build up problem everyone else was having back then.
Worked great. So don't be afraid to think out side the box a bit. Be creative in your hobby.

My first reef

Hope this helps. Get some pictures up once you buy this. I would like to see the inside of that filter.

Frank

 

[Frankie]

The overflow hookups on your tank look solid also. The bulk heads look well made. I would replace that metal ring clamp with something plastic in the future. It's going to rust from the saltwater.

 

[reef rider]

I'm going to see the system this weekend.Will take some pics.I planned to run a protien skimmer,not sure which one yet.On my smaller systems I've been running Aqua C skimmers only twice a week,for 24 hours.No heavy fish load. Both tanks have small refugiums,with deep sand beds, 15 and 20 gallon.Weekly water changes.No real problems to date.I use the less is more phylossify.I'm hoping I can convert this sump into a refugium.Lighting for this build,I have the option of going with 2 250W metal halides with four HO T5's,96 watt total.Do you think this is overkill,too much for this tank?Could also go with 150w halides with the same T5's.I plan on refinishing the stand and bringing everything as close to new as possible.This will be a slow build.I'd like to do it right the first time and keep costs down.Thanks for your help Frankie! Tony

 

[Peppie]

reef rider
Welcome to RF
I thought I would chimm in by letting you know you are in good hands with all the advice you are receiving from Frankie.
I agree strongly on his advice about building a new sump for your system. The cost is minimal in the over all picture of the total system. An efficient running sump will improve your chances of a successful reef.

 

[reef rider]

Hey peppie, Thanks for the welcome. I was hoping to make a fuge out of this sump.Haven't had a good look at it yet.I may well end up making one if this sump doesn't cut it.I don't like to waste equipment.I've never built one myself.I would like to get some specs for baffle,compartment, sizes.Any tips would help. It's been good talking with Frankie.I like his system and fuge in the pic he posted. Thanks Tony

 

[reef rider]

Hey peppie, I found a sump design, left-overflow/skimmer, center-return, right-refugium, plumed to feed skimmer area and fuge area independently from one overflow line. 75% flow to skimmer, 25% to fuge, controlled by valves. I thought it would be a benifit, reducing flow to the fuge. Or doesn't this really have a benifit? Also, is it a good or bad idea to build in areas to hold media for mechanical filtration? I see some Pics of systems that don't seem to have any in the sump. How do they keep the return pump free of debri. Building in these areas will decrease my conpartment sizes. Also going to go with flexible plumbing. Any downside to this? I have a fuge designer in my area that thinks this design is unnecessary and of no real benifit over the left-overflow/skimmer, center-fuge, right-return design, which would be easier to plum. Thanks,Tony

 

[TJL]

Hey Tony, IMHO go with the simple sump layout of 2-3 compartments Skimmer/Heater/Probe? section~Refugium section~Return section with an over-under baffle from 1st into 2nd and a solid w/ toothed top divider or even just egg crating to screen out macro into Return section. By having the last two sections only screened off this will give you a larger volume area to have an ATO system run more effectively and lesser chance of having return pump run dry. I have ran High-flow & Ultra High-flow Sump/Refugiums with mixed macros for more than 20 years and would not do it any other way. Also typically without traditional bubble traps, a large bed of macro's remove micro-bubbles very well. Anyhow, looking forward to seeing your progress in whichever way you decide to go.

Cheers, Todd

 

[reef rider]

Thanks Todd! I thought there was a benifit to slowing the flow to the fuge area as far as oganisims, benificial to the corals, and nitrate reduction. Maybe I'm reading a bit too much and not quite understanding. If configuration is the only difference here, I'll go with your suggestion. It will make things more simple, as far as my first build. Should I try to do mechanical filtration in this sump, carbon, phos remover, floss, and if so where would be the best place to locate it? My sump will only be 30"x12"x 16". Thanks again, Tony

 

[eww]

Hey Tony. Here is one sump Todd (TJL) and I built with the 3 chamber setup. The first one on the left is where the drain lets into and the skimmer sits. The second one is where we put the macros and LR and is almost open to the third one which is the return chamber. We only went with a short solid baffle between chambers 2 and 3 and installed a removable piece of egg crate above that to help keep the macros at bay from the return pump. It worked awesome and was only 36" wide.

Installed (you can see the egg crate separator on the right)

This sump is quite a bit larger but is another design that is working well and could be scaled down. This is a 60" long 100 gallon tank the I converted into a sump and it flows right to left this time. There is only one single baffle between the first chamber (return/skimmer section) on the right and the fuge/return section on the left. The idea of no bubble trap was because there is more than 42" of fuge length to diffuse any bubbles before getting to the return pump. I installed a small box around the return outlet with lots of holes drilled in it. In this case we are running an external return pump but it could have easily been an internal one with a slightly larger box around it. Just another option and this give us tons of room for evap so the return pump should never run dry.

 

[TJL]

Great ^design^ looks familiar hmmm....

I chopped down a 75g acrylic by 3" for my sump/fuge

made a bracket for a rectangular filter sock so that it can easily be accessed/removed for cleaning. attached a short length of collapsable discharge hose onto bulkhead to have outlet below waterline for noise control. This also allows the sock to be slid out without having to remove a solid pipe pc.

this is mostly complete plumbing, and my small cryptic zone area screening off the return pump outlet. I have Bio-balls covered in sponges, feather dusters and tunicates that will go into this chamber with lid to access if needed.

My returns (not 100% yet) 3/4" SeaSwirl rated at 800gph and excess flow through Loc-Line that can be directed at dead spots or ???

Hope this helps or at least gives you some additional ideas to how yoou might plumb out yours.

Cheers, Todd

 

[reef rider]

Thanks TJL and eww. I am going to design like the smaller one in eww's reply. Do you run a dsb or just lr and macro? Do you have dsb in dt? I was going to run with 3" in dt and 4-5" in refugium with some macro. Do you use any carbon or any other mechanical filtration, other than lr. I'm going to use a phosban reactor but I also run carbon from time to time and trying to decide where to best do this. If I use bulkheads, for overflow and return, in the sump, will this run quiet vrs. just dropping lines in? Thanks again, Tony

 

[TJL]

Hey, sorry fogot about your questions to filter media. I run a mix of carbon and GFO in a Phosban-150 reactor, the carbon seems to help the Ferous Oxide from clumping up to much. Running your outlet below waterline really helps noise-wise but, only works well with Herbie style drains without having alot of air being sucked down into plumbing. On Durso or other styles the back pressure from trapped air can cause some issues and LARGE belching/burping noises. My backup plan with using the discharge hose is that I can easily take a hole punch to make an escapement for trapped air. I'm currently running an 1-1/2" or so mud bed in my fuge for some anaerobic bacterial growth and will probably do the same for new system. Have always been a little leary of traditional 4-6" DSB burping Methane gas if disturbed or ??? A little paranoid I know, so have never went that route. Another benefit of high-flow sump/fuges, not likely to have much stagnant water anywhere IMO.

Cheers, Todd

 

[reef rider]

Thanks for the info Todd. Checked out 225 build. Very nice work. Can't wait to see the finished product. I can see I have a lot to learn.

 

[reef rider]

Hey Todd. I'm thinking of purchasing a all in one light fixture for this build. I'm looking at Current USA 2x250w mh with 4 actinic-4x39w and Odyssea 1x250w mh with 4 actinic-4x39w. Mixed reef being considered. Would the Current Fixture be overkill, running the mh shorter period, vs Odyssea, running mh longer, achieving the same outcome. any thoughts on these fixtures

 

[reef rider]

The Oceanic Tank's overflow has a plastic tube with holes from top to bottom. I'm thinking this is going to create a 15"-20" waterfall inside my overflow box with only a few inches of water in the bottom. Very noisy. Is my only, or best option a durso drain tube? Where can I find info on durso, herbie style drain systems for my own education?