Thinking about calcium reactors...

[jrgilles]

So, I'm thinking I want to adding in a calcium reactor to my system. My understanding of them is poor though. Could someone point me to a good reference?

Couple questions I have:
1. With a calcium reactor, do I not need to dose kalk anymore? I currently have a drip going. Seems the Ca Reactor would take care of the calcium, but my kalk additions are currently keeping my pH up. The Ca reactor will decrease the pH in my system, correct? So I will still have to do something for pH control?

2. I see the ca reactors come with controllers. I have a neptune apex. Could I use that to control the Ca reactor? Or do I need something else since it will be controlling the CO2 gas?

3. Any recommendations on good Ca reactors to look at? My total system volume is about 120 gal. My DT is 75 gal...

Would also be interested in a nice used system once I understand better what I actually need to get things running.

If I'm still going to need to add kalk to keep the pH up, I might first buy a kalk reactor, as I'm getting tired of mixing up kalk constantly....

rob

 

[returnofsid]

Here's a few really good references, that should answer all of your questions, and more.

http://www.melevsreef.com/calcium_reactor.html

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-05/sh/feature/index.php

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/calcreactors.htm

Depending on how you handle your effluent, a Calcium Reactor won't necessarily lower your pH.

 

[jrgilles]

awesome, thanks a lot sid. About to head out to brunch, but I'll read through all of these links when I get back. Appreciate it. I really need to educate myself about these, as I think it would be a great thing to add in to my system.

 

[Chingon]

Thank you Sid, the links made things more clear and changed my mind on selling the reactor.

 

[jrgilles]

Thanks for the reading sid, just went through all the articles. Seems I want a calcium reactor with a second chamber to help degas the CO2 before entering the system. If I lose pH, I'll either try a buffer, adding kalk to my top-off or adding in a kalk reactor.

Any suggestions on what is a good reactor for my system (see signiture)? If anyone has a good used system they don't want, please shoot me a pm. I'll check the for sale forums too.

Thanks for the help!

 

[returnofsid]

Rob, while a Calcium Reactor, with a second chamber is nice, it's not necessary. You can "revive" your pH by running your effluent into the side of your refugium where your skimmer is. In this way, the effluent will get aerated, driving the pH back up. Some people also run their effluent into a small container, such as a tupperware or saucer, where it then drains into their sump. This allows the effluent contact with air, driving the pH back up.

 

[Herefishyfishy]

Rob, while a Calcium Reactor, with a second chamber is nice, it's not necessary. You can "revive" your pH by running your effluent into the side of your refugium where your skimmer is. In this way, the effluent will get aerated, driving the pH back up. Some people also run their effluent into a small container, such as a tupperware or saucer, where it then drains into their sump. This allows the effluent contact with air, driving the pH back up.

That cup is a handy place to test the effluent's Ph by kit, meter, or controller.

 

[King_Neptune]

1. Your typically going to see a kalk drip or reactor to counter the effects of the calcium reactor. Often people will dose with kalk on a drip to save in equipment costs. A cheap alternative is to make your own solution. Pickling lime from Walmart(sold next to the food vacum sealers) in a cheap drip bucket is about as cheap as it gets.
Step it up in price and you can get a reactor. I have my eye on this one:
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/store/products/reactors/kalkwasser-reactor
Or you can DIY an effective reactor as well...but by the time you get the pump,timer,parts, labor....is it really worth it? Especially since it wont be as effective.

2. I see the ca reactors come with controllers. I have a neptune apex. Could I use that to control the Ca reactor? Or do I need something else since it will be controlling the CO2 gas?
The solenoid controls the gas, the controller controls the solenoid on/off. A PH probe is inserted and is used to tell the controller on/off

3. Any recommendations on good Ca reactors to look at? My total system volume is about 120 gal. My DT is 75 gal...
There are so many out there, I have a Korallian myself that I plan to hook up someday. They range in price, there really is few "Bad" reactors. Since its kind of hard to mess it up. The things too look for are the pumps they use. I got mine because it had an eheim pump. The Co2, solenoid, probe, controller, kalk are all going to be extra. So as you can see, its not cheap to get setup.

Would also be interested in a nice used system once I understand better what I actually need to get things running.
You see them all the time, $300-350 is a typical fair asking price. Some come with more than others. I payed 320 for mine, and I got a Co2, solinoid, pump, reactor. So Id say I came out with a pretty smoking deal. Since the reactor alone retailed for almost $700

If I'm still going to need to add kalk to keep the pH up, I might first buy a kalk reactor, as I'm getting tired of mixing up kalk constantly....
Again...http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/store/products/reactors/kalkwasser-reactor
[/QUOTE]


Hope this helps.

 

[jrgilles]

Awesome, thanks for the info. Good to know the second chamber isn't needed.

If it does have a second chamber, can you put any media you want in it? Does the lower pH water going in make anything more effecient (ie. carbon, phosban, etc.)?

I currently have a kalk drip going, I'm just getting a bit tired of mixing it up every week. Might just add it to the top off water or get a reactor if I want to keep doing it.

Mine is currently run by a cheap lift pump and 2 tupperware containers with saturated kalk in them. It then turns on for a minute every hour if conditions are met (ie. ph <8.1, time between lights out and lights on.)

Figured kalk reactors are pretty cheap, so I could just put one inline with my media reactor/uv sterilizer chain.

Looking at this reactor right now. Looks like a good setup I think. Any opinions? Is this too much reactor for my system? A bit on the pricier side for used, but...

http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56923

 

[King_Neptune]

If it does have a second chamber, can you put any media you want in it?
no. this is for calcium only.
Does the lower pH water going in make anything more effecient (ie. carbon, phosban, etc.)?
intersting, i would postulate no, but it may help a little.


Looking at this reactor right now. Looks like a good setup I think. Any opinions? Is this too much reactor for my system? A bit on the pricier side for used, but...
Nothing wrong with it. Like I said...most sell for near the $300 mark w/o a co2/solinoid or media. So you wouldn't be losting if you got this setup.

 

[Frankie]

Just so you know, you can add magnisium to a Ca-rx and fine tune the Mg also.
There are many sources for Mg.
Boomer turned me onto dolomite and it worked perfectly. Just add 25% dolomite or another Mg. source like ZEOmag or some such and mix it into the crushed coral media prior to loading the reactor.
When I built my reactor I added the second chamber and noticed the PH went back up after the second chamber. I have 2 quick connect valves, one on each tower for testing the towers effluent. The PH was always higher in the second chamber.
Also I never had PH problems when using my DIY reactor. I think the super large skimmer I was running had a lot to do with that though because I had the air lines plumbed to the outside.
Here is a picture of the reactor i made:

 

[jrgilles]

great reactor!

I think I heard awhile ago about adding mg to the reactor, but forgot. Thanks for reminding me. I will be sure to add some dolomite in. Even more reason to get it. Help maintain ca, mg and alk.

 

[Frankie]

Dolomite is pretty cheap, most LFS can get it by Estes.
It does not dissolve as quickly as crushed coral, though the ZeoMag seemed to work just as well.

 

[DonW]

The problem with most ph issues and carx's is the operator or the reactor itself. Most reactors on the market are not efficient they wont get the alk up high enough so the drip rate needs to be excessive. The Koralin is one of those reactor they work ok except for the gas trap issues but they are far from efficient. A second chamber is not needed on any reactor that is run efficiently. Secondary media like Mg can be added to the main chamber and the second chamber does little in helping with ph issues. Most time we se people running reactor at somewhere around 30 - 40 dkh this is pretty low and inefficient. The effluent rate needs to be to high on a high demand tank that it dumps the ph. An efficient reactor will run about 60-80 dkh and have a real slow drip rate at the same ph. This makes it so much easier to off gas the excess co2.
CARX's are not an area where I'd attempt to save money. The highest quality regulator you can find will prevent problems and crashes. A controller is not needed and is just another failure point. There is a reason Deltec and Schuran reactors are so expensive, they spent the money on R&D. They produce double or triple the alk at a comparable drip rate. This in the long run makes for a pain free calcium reactor experience.

Don

 

[jrgilles]

Hey don, what do you think of the reef octapus I linked at the end of a previous post? Rated up to 600 gallons, but my system is just 75 in the display. What do you think of its effeciency? Went to barrier reef yesterday and chatted with them a bit. They thought it was an ok reactor, but id be very interested in your opinion

 

[DonW]

Hey don, what do you think of the reef octapus I linked at the end of a previous post? Rated up to 600 gallons, but my system is just 75 in the display. What do you think of its effeciency? Went to barrier reef yesterday and chatted with them a bit. They thought it was an ok reactor, but id be very interested in your opinion

I have never used one. If I wanted a new reactor I'd pole effluent dkh. Meaning ask folks what they are hitting at what bubble rate and drip count. For example a Schuran pico will run at about 80 dkh at 60 ml min at 1 bubble per two seconds. This cranking out some serious alk with very little co2 and is very easy to of gas and has little to no effect on display ph. Hope that makes some good sense.

Don

 

[jrgilles]

OK, awesome. Hoping to get a used setup to save some money, but I'll poll people and search forums on different models to see if I can get a Bubble:Fow Rate:dkh ratio.

Thanks don

 

[Maxx]

I've used both a Korallin C1502 and a Geo 612. I sold the Korallin and bought the Geo.
I found the Korallin to be difficult to adjust properly and at the time, the media I was using was not the right stuff for this reactor. I was using the standard ARM media which dissolves at a higher pH than other media, and the Korallin is designed to be very miserly on Co2 and operate at a much lower pH level....turning my media to mush.

I havent used the regular ARM media since getting the Geo so I cant definitively state which caused the issues, the reactor design or the media itself. I do find the Geo to be very easy to clean, adjust, set up and maintain.

I only use a single tower and drip my effluent into my sump where the main display drains. This area has lots of bubbles and turbulence so it doesnt affect my pH negatively.

Nick

 

[Chingon]

where can you buy the fluid for the bubbler on the controller.

 

[jrgilles]

Thanks for the help guys. I backed out of the octopus reactor and ended up getting a pm about buying a Geo 612. From the research I've done online, the geo's seem like great reactors. Can't wait to get it set up and running.

Thanks for all the discussion and input while I tried to figure this all out.

cheers,
rob