Curtswearing
Mantisfreak
Chris,
Do you speak Italian or are you using the Babelfish translator?
Do you speak Italian or are you using the Babelfish translator?
A little reading: Blue Coral Method
- Thread starter ReeferPatt
- Start date
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Fabio
Member
Ci sono diversi amminoacidi che possono avere un effetto interessante sulla calcificazione dei coralli.
la glutammina sicuramente è utile...
io stò usando l'acido aspartico e funziona in maniera impressionante sui coralli...
dopo aver fatto diversi studi sulla composizione del gh, sono arrivato a scegliere l'acido aspartico come amminoacido sostitutivo al posto del hgh.
io non uso ormone...
l'acido aspartico(che è sempre un amminoacido) è perfetto perchè regola la sintesi proteica.
maggiore è la sintesi proteica, più alto è il tasso di calcificazione...in questo modo si vedono i coralli crescere in maniera ottimale...
ovviamente questo non significa esasperare la crescita a livelli esagerati...non serve...
queste montipore sono cresciute in un mese...si nota la differenza....
perdonate le foto scadenti...
chris&barb
Reef-Geeks
translation
There are various amino acids that can have an interesting effect on the calcification of corals. the glutammina sure is useful... I stò using aspartic acid and works in impressive way on corals... after to have made various studies on the composition of the gh, they have succeeded in to choose aspartic acid like substitutive amino acid in place of hgh. I I do not use hormone... the acid aspartico(che is always an amino acid) is perfect why it regulated the greater synthesis proteica. is the proteica synthesis, plus high this montipore is the calcification rate... in this way is looked at corals to grow in optimal way... obviously this does not mean to exasperate the increase to levels exaggerates... servants to you... has not grown in a famous month... the difference.... pardoned the poor photos
There are various amino acids that can have an interesting effect on the calcification of corals. the glutammina sure is useful... I stò using aspartic acid and works in impressive way on corals... after to have made various studies on the composition of the gh, they have succeeded in to choose aspartic acid like substitutive amino acid in place of hgh. I I do not use hormone... the acid aspartico(che is always an amino acid) is perfect why it regulated the greater synthesis proteica. is the proteica synthesis, plus high this montipore is the calcification rate... in this way is looked at corals to grow in optimal way... obviously this does not mean to exasperate the increase to levels exaggerates... servants to you... has not grown in a famous month... the difference.... pardoned the poor photos
chris&barb
Reef-Geeks
chris&barb
Reef-Geeks
thank you Fabio
so you use aspartic acid?
grazie Fabio così usate l'acido aspartico?
so you use aspartic acid?
grazie Fabio così usate l'acido aspartico?
Fabio
Member
chris&barb
Reef-Geeks
grazie Fabio
Llarian
Well-known member
I do believe that is one of the best uses of babelfish I've seen yet.
I don't have any SPS currently, but I'll certainly give this a shot when I finally get an SPS tank setup!
-Dylan
I don't have any SPS currently, but I'll certainly give this a shot when I finally get an SPS tank setup!
-Dylan
SueT
Well-known member
Thank you Fabio for helping in this. I have been using BluCoral for approximately 8 weeks now.
ReeferPatt
Well-known member
I would like to Thank Fabio and Ocean Drive for coming on the site and supporting this thread. These are the people from whom I learned this method of feeding. And yes I got most of the info. from RC, and pasted the article here for more people learn about it. When used correctly, which is easy by the way, it is far superior and cheaper than anything I've used or heard of.
spongebob lover
flea whisperer
Grazie Favio (sto seguendo questo filetto).
the opnly thing that i was trying to point out is the coral food supllemnt i use has alot of vitamins and other benifical stuff
at the end of the day when is all said and done if your corals live and grow what more could u ask for
at the end of the day when is all said and done if your corals live and grow what more could u ask for
ReeferPatt
Well-known member
You can't ask for more than that. If their healthy and happy it's all good!
SueT
Well-known member
and mine are happier than they've been in a while....
class clown
Well-known member
FYI to all - I'm temporarily on hold with this method until I get my calcium reactor working right again (seems to be a leak somewhere) and get done with some major rearranging/fragging and get a rock with some hair algae under control.
Just wanted to post that I did see some positive growth on several of my corals although I only used it twice- primarily visable difference on a blue stag, slimer, and red monti. And, I'm now seeing very clear water too..
I've been reading some of the forums on RC in the meanwhile (http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=971190&perpage=25&pagenumber=1). And had a question for reeferpatt...
From this post on page 29 of the RC forum, you state "500mg will be spread out over probably a 90 day period. Once I get to 90 days I will make a new recipe and whatever is left from first batch will be thrown away and replaced with new."
What is the purpose of purging the food after 90 days? it's frozen, so I wouldn't think it would go bad. Maybe you can add a little bit more background ot this. Just wondering if i should also purge any extras I have after 90 days too.
Thanks in advance for any advice you can share.
Just wanted to post that I did see some positive growth on several of my corals although I only used it twice- primarily visable difference on a blue stag, slimer, and red monti. And, I'm now seeing very clear water too..
I've been reading some of the forums on RC in the meanwhile (http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=971190&perpage=25&pagenumber=1). And had a question for reeferpatt...
From this post on page 29 of the RC forum, you state "500mg will be spread out over probably a 90 day period. Once I get to 90 days I will make a new recipe and whatever is left from first batch will be thrown away and replaced with new."
What is the purpose of purging the food after 90 days? it's frozen, so I wouldn't think it would go bad. Maybe you can add a little bit more background ot this. Just wondering if i should also purge any extras I have after 90 days too.
Thanks in advance for any advice you can share.
ReeferPatt
Well-known member
At the time I believe it was mentioned somewhere in the RC thread that after around 90 days it would start to loose some of it's potentency. To be honest I really don't think it is necessary. I don't think you can use an entire batch in 90 days unless you have a larger system or your feeding 3x a week. So I seriously doubt I will purge what's left over. I will be using the entire batch and make new. In my next batch though I'm going to use asperatic acid instead of the GLN.
class clown
Well-known member
Thanks Robert - yeah, i was thinking about the asperitic acid too. I've got a bunch left in this batch yet - good to know I don't have to get rid of all of it.
class clown
Well-known member
So this thread started off by quoting a rough english translation of Fabio's article on Reefitalia magazine, but it was a little difficult ot understand in my opinion (definatley no offence intended).
In case others find it more valuable, here is an alternative translation to english.. personally I found this easier to read and understand.
The Blu Coral Method
Many people have the opportunity to see the magnificent tanks managed with this method and many others are interested in learning about it. The creator of this method was Maurizio Manili, who thanks to the collaboration with other passionate reefers, succeeded to bring the method to its current point. Today, the BC method was inherited from Valerio Pacetti, the owner of the actual Blu Coral shop in Rome, and ex-associate of Maurizio Manili, who as of now improved the old consolidated method with a few modifications. This article will talk about how the method functions and how to succeed in augmenting the growth of corals. First two big distinctions must be made: if you want to manage a tank by utilizing the simple “pappone” (coral food) or if you want to follow the BC method exactly to the letter. The base of both systems of management is the same and involves: the classic Berlin Method, good water chemistry, and the pappone feedings.
Classic Berlin Method:
The Berlin Method is characterized by strong lighting, strong water movement, an efficient skimmer, and live rock.
Water Chemistry:
You must give particular attention to this aspect, which leads to positive results for all types of management of the BC method. In particular, the parameters of the water are maintained in concentrations that are elevated in respect to parameters that are successful in nature: Magnesium 1500 mg/L, Calcium 500 mg/L, Strontium 16-30 mg/L, Carbonate Hardness (dkH) 12-14 mg/L, Iodine 0.06 mg/L, and nutrients near zero. This allows the corals at any moment to have the necessary materials for constructing their skeletons and therefore they have a sort of “reserve” of chemical elements.
Pappone:
This is the difference that determines the distinction between who follows the method to the letter or instead who utilizes only some parts. However in general, the pappone is identical in both of the methods, and is prepared in this way: you use mollusks that are strictly fresh. In general, you use 5 mussels, 5 clams, 5 shrimp, and 5 oysters. You put all of these into a container (no shells, just meat), then add 250 mL of RO water, then add 1 tablespoon of sugar, however some also use fructose. Then you blend everything vigorously until the whole mixture reaches the consistency of cream. At this point is the distinction between who uses the method to the letter and who instead does not. In the BC method, the pappone is enriched in respect to the original recipe, with the polypeptide hormone somatropin or GH. In general, you use about 1.33 mg of somatropin, which corresponds to the 4 unit vial. You then mix and prepare the cubes, then put them away in the freezer.
GH, what is it?
GH or Somatropin, is a human polypeptide of small dimensions, that presents a noticeably different structure in different species. It is therefore derived with an elevated biological specificity, in the sense that the GH from one species is in general completely different and therefore inactive in others; in the case of humans, the only one that has any effect is from simian GH (mainly in Rhesus monkeys). Vice-versa, human GH acts only in simians and not in non-primate organisms. The sequence of 191 amino acids is in a linear chain that carries out two fundamentally important actions in humans: the growth of the body, and the regulation of cellular metabolism, specifically that of protein synthesis. To summarize, GH does not act on other mammals, and obviously does not act on invertebrates. This is simply demonstrated by the fact that the hormone in question, in order to be utilized, requires specific receptors on the cellular membrane of the target cell on which it acts. Obviously the corals and other invertebrates do not have these correct receptors, because if they did have them, it would mean that they use GH in the same manner-- an improbable phenomenon.
The Enhanced Growth…
How are you then able to explain the enhanced growth and the increase in metabolism of the corals in conjunction with the increase in calcification?
In experience, this does happen. A few of the more skilled aquarists who utilize this method, had growth of A. Formosa, A. cervicornis, A. nobilis, Montipora sp. , up to 40cm per year. Also M. foliosa, LPS, and soft corals grew in an impressive manner.
I made up my mind about what could be happening in the water. Therefore the precise but short explanation will be following the fruits of my labor and my observations; however that does not mean that is it is the absolute truth. The explanation will be sought for in the typical structural and molecular characteristics of the GH. Being a protein that is small enough, it is very probable that the GH put in the pappone breaks up. This is the point of the discussion. It is not the integral GH that acts directly on the corals, because of the points explained above are very improbable. It likely is based on the GH being broken, which influences the growth and the increased metabolism.
At the time in which we go to feed our corals with pappone, we are in reality adding many amino acids into the water. In fact, when the protein is broken, it is split into many pieces—its amino acid constituents. Therefore the abundance of determined and specified amino acids are involved the increased rate of growth.
This is the only explanation which arose after many different observations. In this way it is effectively possible to explain, from a biological point of view, how the GH is able to influence the corals.
These amino acids that are introduced with the GH are combined with the amino acids that are usually dosed around 2 hours before the pappone feeding, in order to encourage assimilation.
The rest of the components of the pappone (mussels, clams, etc.) go to feed the bacterial cultures, the sponges, and all of the benthic organisms, which thus go to feed the corals. If you succeed in having a situation where you maximize the feeding corals, you then have the possibility of having maximum calcification, seeing that you have an abundance of nutrition and chemical components. This whole discussion obviously does not regard the fish, which are not influenced by the abundance or lack of amino acids present in water; in effect the fish have absolutely normal rates of growth.
In general, one of the aspects that characterize the Blu Coral Method is that after the system stabilizes, you have a reduction of general nutrients that remains near zero, in regards to the phosphates and the nitrates. The whole system helps the intake of amino acids. It is especially important at the beginning for everyone to find the appropriate dose of pappone to administer to the tank. A fundamental rule is to watch your animals and understand how much feeding they need.
I hope to have clarified this subject a little more, because between all methods, this is one of the best methods of managing a reef tank, whether you utilize the GH, or if you take the basics of this method without using the hormone. Good wishes to all the readers of the Magazine and see you soon!
The author of the article, the aquarists mentioned in this article, and reefitalia.net are not responsible for inappropriate use of the hormone; from a legal standpoint, by the use of whoever decides to proceed. We are also not responsible for any negative outcomes to your tank or animals.
Fabio Oggiano aka SiR
(Translated by DarkXerox)
In case others find it more valuable, here is an alternative translation to english.. personally I found this easier to read and understand.
The Blu Coral Method
Many people have the opportunity to see the magnificent tanks managed with this method and many others are interested in learning about it. The creator of this method was Maurizio Manili, who thanks to the collaboration with other passionate reefers, succeeded to bring the method to its current point. Today, the BC method was inherited from Valerio Pacetti, the owner of the actual Blu Coral shop in Rome, and ex-associate of Maurizio Manili, who as of now improved the old consolidated method with a few modifications. This article will talk about how the method functions and how to succeed in augmenting the growth of corals. First two big distinctions must be made: if you want to manage a tank by utilizing the simple “pappone” (coral food) or if you want to follow the BC method exactly to the letter. The base of both systems of management is the same and involves: the classic Berlin Method, good water chemistry, and the pappone feedings.
Classic Berlin Method:
The Berlin Method is characterized by strong lighting, strong water movement, an efficient skimmer, and live rock.
Water Chemistry:
You must give particular attention to this aspect, which leads to positive results for all types of management of the BC method. In particular, the parameters of the water are maintained in concentrations that are elevated in respect to parameters that are successful in nature: Magnesium 1500 mg/L, Calcium 500 mg/L, Strontium 16-30 mg/L, Carbonate Hardness (dkH) 12-14 mg/L, Iodine 0.06 mg/L, and nutrients near zero. This allows the corals at any moment to have the necessary materials for constructing their skeletons and therefore they have a sort of “reserve” of chemical elements.
Pappone:
This is the difference that determines the distinction between who follows the method to the letter or instead who utilizes only some parts. However in general, the pappone is identical in both of the methods, and is prepared in this way: you use mollusks that are strictly fresh. In general, you use 5 mussels, 5 clams, 5 shrimp, and 5 oysters. You put all of these into a container (no shells, just meat), then add 250 mL of RO water, then add 1 tablespoon of sugar, however some also use fructose. Then you blend everything vigorously until the whole mixture reaches the consistency of cream. At this point is the distinction between who uses the method to the letter and who instead does not. In the BC method, the pappone is enriched in respect to the original recipe, with the polypeptide hormone somatropin or GH. In general, you use about 1.33 mg of somatropin, which corresponds to the 4 unit vial. You then mix and prepare the cubes, then put them away in the freezer.
GH, what is it?
GH or Somatropin, is a human polypeptide of small dimensions, that presents a noticeably different structure in different species. It is therefore derived with an elevated biological specificity, in the sense that the GH from one species is in general completely different and therefore inactive in others; in the case of humans, the only one that has any effect is from simian GH (mainly in Rhesus monkeys). Vice-versa, human GH acts only in simians and not in non-primate organisms. The sequence of 191 amino acids is in a linear chain that carries out two fundamentally important actions in humans: the growth of the body, and the regulation of cellular metabolism, specifically that of protein synthesis. To summarize, GH does not act on other mammals, and obviously does not act on invertebrates. This is simply demonstrated by the fact that the hormone in question, in order to be utilized, requires specific receptors on the cellular membrane of the target cell on which it acts. Obviously the corals and other invertebrates do not have these correct receptors, because if they did have them, it would mean that they use GH in the same manner-- an improbable phenomenon.
The Enhanced Growth…
How are you then able to explain the enhanced growth and the increase in metabolism of the corals in conjunction with the increase in calcification?
In experience, this does happen. A few of the more skilled aquarists who utilize this method, had growth of A. Formosa, A. cervicornis, A. nobilis, Montipora sp. , up to 40cm per year. Also M. foliosa, LPS, and soft corals grew in an impressive manner.
I made up my mind about what could be happening in the water. Therefore the precise but short explanation will be following the fruits of my labor and my observations; however that does not mean that is it is the absolute truth. The explanation will be sought for in the typical structural and molecular characteristics of the GH. Being a protein that is small enough, it is very probable that the GH put in the pappone breaks up. This is the point of the discussion. It is not the integral GH that acts directly on the corals, because of the points explained above are very improbable. It likely is based on the GH being broken, which influences the growth and the increased metabolism.
At the time in which we go to feed our corals with pappone, we are in reality adding many amino acids into the water. In fact, when the protein is broken, it is split into many pieces—its amino acid constituents. Therefore the abundance of determined and specified amino acids are involved the increased rate of growth.
This is the only explanation which arose after many different observations. In this way it is effectively possible to explain, from a biological point of view, how the GH is able to influence the corals.
These amino acids that are introduced with the GH are combined with the amino acids that are usually dosed around 2 hours before the pappone feeding, in order to encourage assimilation.
The rest of the components of the pappone (mussels, clams, etc.) go to feed the bacterial cultures, the sponges, and all of the benthic organisms, which thus go to feed the corals. If you succeed in having a situation where you maximize the feeding corals, you then have the possibility of having maximum calcification, seeing that you have an abundance of nutrition and chemical components. This whole discussion obviously does not regard the fish, which are not influenced by the abundance or lack of amino acids present in water; in effect the fish have absolutely normal rates of growth.
In general, one of the aspects that characterize the Blu Coral Method is that after the system stabilizes, you have a reduction of general nutrients that remains near zero, in regards to the phosphates and the nitrates. The whole system helps the intake of amino acids. It is especially important at the beginning for everyone to find the appropriate dose of pappone to administer to the tank. A fundamental rule is to watch your animals and understand how much feeding they need.
I hope to have clarified this subject a little more, because between all methods, this is one of the best methods of managing a reef tank, whether you utilize the GH, or if you take the basics of this method without using the hormone. Good wishes to all the readers of the Magazine and see you soon!
The author of the article, the aquarists mentioned in this article, and reefitalia.net are not responsible for inappropriate use of the hormone; from a legal standpoint, by the use of whoever decides to proceed. We are also not responsible for any negative outcomes to your tank or animals.
Fabio Oggiano aka SiR
(Translated by DarkXerox)
SueT
Well-known member
great reading Ben.. sorry you have to stop the feeding for a while especially since you are seeing improved growth. I'm sure you'll be able to get back to it soon. I am at every 5 days and am seeing incredible growth. Basically in all my acropora and montipora. I also have 1 green polyp pocillopora and it's growing extremely fast too.
class clown
Well-known member
Hey no biggie. I'll be back in the swing of things here in no time - hopeing I can get started by the end of the week actually. I just picked up a bunch of new frags & am continuing to thin out some existing stock. Once I get it thinned out, I just need to fix my calcium reactor and figure out a good way to keep my calcium/alk/magnesium levels high while not dropping my ph too much.
As you can see in my ticker below, I'm at a pretty consistent 7.9 PH all day long. :doubt:
Kalk reactor?
manual kalk drips?
open to any other ideas too?
As you can see in my ticker below, I'm at a pretty consistent 7.9 PH all day long. :doubt:
Kalk reactor?
manual kalk drips?
open to any other ideas too?
