My New Metal Halides

[Krish]

K...So I'm home now. Lights have been on for almost 5 hours. I left home with a temperature of 80.9F and got home to a temperature of 81.2F. So it only went up 0.3. Seems pretty stable to me, but not exactly where I want it to be stable at. I'd rather be more along the lines of topping off at 80F (at the highest point) and maybe sitting at a minimum of 79.5F, but I'm very grateful for where it is now. Not sure exactly where I will go from here to achieve those numbers... I'm wondering if relocating the side fans to the back of the canopy will cool it better, if I should just swap out the 2 side fans for fans that blow a little more breeze, or just add another 5 inch fan to the back of the canopy giving me a total of 6 fans cooling the canopy. Anyways, I may just leave it as it is for now and see if the tank can work off that extra 0.3 degrees tonight and where it will end up tomorrow after work. In any event, the heat issue has come a long way from being as high as 86 degrees with about a 6 degree temp swing, to sitting at 81.2 at the highest point of the day with less than a half degree swing. Thanks again everyone for all of the help you've given me thus far. Not much more left to do from here

 

[gman0526]

Not much more left to do from here

What the hell are you talking about??????? Now you need to make that coral wish list, to start stocking that baby up

I'm really happy for you, this has been a "heated" battle.

"OMG that was as lame as i could get."

 

[Krish]

What the hell are you talking about??????? Now you need to make that coral wish list, to start stocking that baby up

I'm really happy for you, this has been a "heated" battle.

"OMG that was as lame as i could get."

ROFL! Thanks man...You guys really helped me out a lot! I'm still a little un-easy about the numbers as to whether they are set too high. I just started up a new thread asking for the ideal temp for a tank. Maybe you guys can check it out

Thanks again

 

[Scooterman]

Dude ride it out a week then go buy some corals & stuff!

 

[CarlaW]

Dude ride it out a week then go buy some corals & stuff!

THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Krish]

I third it! Well...I think I'm going to still check out those 110v fans anyway in the morning, to see what they are all about...If they blow better and are just as quiet, I may do a swap with the two 5 inch fans and keep the 12V ones with the converters for back ups (Shhh...I have 4 back up brand new fans sitting downstairs just incase so 2 more won't hurt) You can never be too prepared these days!

Thanks again and again and again (and again) everyone for all the time and patience you guys have given me to help sort things out. I just realized we are on page 17!!! :shock: Really feels great to have you guys to count on when in need...Thanks again

 

[mattseattle]

hey - don't forget to pass on the information regarding the fans and how they work! i would be interested in buying some 110v 5" fans for my new canopy!

 

[Krish]

hey - don't forget to pass on the information regarding the fans and how they work! i would be interested in buying some 110v 5" fans for my new canopy!

Can't you see I hate posting here and sharing any info (LOL) Of course man...I'll even buy one just to bring it home and take a picture for you guys

 

[fishermann]

Krish I had a 75 for several years running 2-250 MH's. I built my own stand and canopy. I had my MH's sitting across the tank, parralell with the canopy and had 4-6" fans on the ends of the canopy blowing air in. Like Reed said fans won't last long sucking all the evaporation through them. You already have a hole in each end for fans and like you found out you don't want fans blowing directly on the bulbs. If you mount the MH's in the center across the canopy, you mount the fans fore and aft and the ends of the canopy so the air is blowing more on the reflectors, but it is moving the heat out from under the reflectors out the top and back of the canopy. IMO the way you have your lights mounted, your reflector edges are very close to the water and are acting like a tent and actually heating your water and also IMO your lighting would be better distributed over the reef if your lights were oriented the other way. The metal of the reflectors get very hot and if you had a fan fore and aft blowing across them from each end I think you would be home free. I was going to say to pull the back off your stand, but after reading further I see you did that. I cut a oblong hole in my stand doors and routed a nice edge, say leaving a 2 or 3" outline and bought some woven caneing material and stapled it to the back side of the doors, and it looked nice and let the stand breath. I don't know what to say about the hole in the center of the ends, guess you could make a nice stained cap and cover it and mount with screws from the inside, maybe mount a nice little wood overlay on the cap and turn your lites and mount 2 fans on each end blowing in. What do you think?, worked great for me.

 

[Krish]

Thanks for the info John...The way you suggested setting up the reflectors parallel with the tank is how I would have done them. However, I just found out last week, that was actually the wrong way to disperse light and that it should be setup like I have it now which is perpendicular. If you want, I can find the threads that it was discussed on but basically the reasoning behind it (if I got it right was) the light is being spread across the tank over-lapping one another the way I have the reflectors now, rather than spinning the reflectors like you suggested, which would cause the light to spread out of the front and back of the tank. My plan with the canopy was for it to be taller than it was built. The idiot who I had do it, built it shorter than I asked, thus the reason the lights are so low. In any event, I angled the 2 side fans down at an angle which misses the bulb, but catches the air right underneath it and then the 3 fans at the top exhaust the hot air. I remember Reed talking about the lifespan of the fans running them like this, but at $5 for the 5 inch fans and $3 for the 3 inch, I don't mind swapping them out every couple of months if I have to I did think about putting the fans to the back of the canopy though and blow cool air in, but I'm limited on where I can mount the fans because of my sea-swirl and Cpr overflow. The spaces I would have left would be pointless to mount there...Thanks again for your input. I really appreciated you stopping in and if you'd like to see those links about the reflectors, just let me know and I'll dig um up

 

[fishermann]

Krish I haven't read the article and if it isn't much trouble I wouldn't mind reading it. I guess all those commercial made light hoods are made wrong with the lights parralell so the air can move through the reflectors. I don't know what to say except that I'm sure it would help fix your problem. I did have 2 on each end of the canopy though, you might could raise your canopy a little higher on say 3" legs and that way you could mount 2 fans on each end and they should be over the height of the sea swirls. All I know Krish is I ran my 75 this way and had no issues with having enough light, had maxima clams low on the reef and lots of SPS. Some times you can over think this hobby. Luck.

 

[Detri]

Great job Krish! Now get some more Zoo's. You need to boil them at around 81-82 degrees for 24 hours. Then you can eat them. hahaha

 

[Krish]

Great job Krish! Now get some more Zoo's. You need to boil them at around 81-82 degrees for 24 hours. Then you can eat them. hahaha

ROFL! Will that get rid of the toxins?

Krish I haven't read the article and if it isn't much trouble I wouldn't mind reading it. I guess all those commercial made light hoods are made wrong with the lights parralell so the air can move through the reflectors. I don't know what to say except that I'm sure it would help fix your problem. I did have 2 on each end of the canopy though, you might could raise your canopy a little higher on say 3" legs and that way you could mount 2 fans on each end and they should be over the height of the sea swirls. All I know Krish is I ran my 75 this way and had no issues with having enough light, had maxima clams low on the reef and lots of SPS. Some times you can over think this hobby. Luck.

Here are a few links that spoke about the reflectors. Scooter will be the best person to give you the info on them because he has (to my understanding) some saved data sheets somewhere or something like that

http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14514

http://www.reeffrontiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14453 (check post number 7 for starters)

I see what you mean about the commercially made hoods. I have a 48inch coralife aqualight and if they were to implement the same concept in that hood with what I have done with my reflectors, one strip would never do and no one wants bulk I guess. But on that same note I can tell you this...I've had the 260w retro coralife on my old setup and I have a 260w aqualight hood, and the hood could never compare to the retro even with running the reflectors parallel like the hood. Also, I've noticed the fans are located on the top of the fixture as well as the exhaust and not to the sides of it...

About me raising the canopy...I could personally never do it. I wouldn't be able to stand the appearance of it and would buy a chiller first, before I did that. I was basically trying to get the heat issue sorted out without a chiller, but by all means if I needed one, I would get one...No problem at all. I can deal with my wife...She'd get over it

Thanks again John for your time and your help

 

[fishermann]

Your aqualight hood is probably inclosed so you get no moisture into the hood if it is MH hood, if it is a PC hood the fans don't pull enough air to matter. Your right about the difference in intensity but that well not change either way you mount the reflectors. As said before people have been doing it for years and haven't had issues.

 

[liveforphysics]

Fisherman- You would really be suprized to know how many products are just flat out not designed properly, or are designed in ways that looks right to an uneducated consumer.

A clasic example is the long rectangular tweeter horns that are used with so many comercial speaker enclosures. The consumer will freak out if you tip the tweeter/horn to be faceing verticle, however, only when faceing verticle does it actually spread sound horizontally across the room.

Dont even get me started with the total lack of engineering in my field of engine part design...

 

[fishermann]

I'm not saying one way is better then the other, but I do know from having done it that the li8ghts well work just fine mounted the other way as I kept high light requiring life with them, may not be as good as the other but sometimes you have to comprimise to acheive a goal. There are alot more people I know running the lights the other way with no cooling issues, I would lot rather loose a little light effectivness {which I'm still not conviced you do} for having my tank run within a safe temp, instead of on the edge. Engineering is not always what is right but what works right overall and that may be a comprimise. Krish can do what he wishes but there is a proven way of doing what he wants to do and accomplish that has worked for years to get rid of the heat in a inclosed hood.

 

[Scooterman]

Hey John, I had my MH like yours for a long time, it will work either way but what we're doing here is a little beyond what the eyes can see. I know you can buy enclosed lighting fixtures & in almost every case if you look at the reflectors they aren't expanded as the retro reflectors, they are tighter thus focusing the light by design parallel to the tank length, key is how they are made & I agree way easier to cool. Now if you look at the spider reflector it can be mounted any way you want but here are things to consider, the height off the water & the width of the reflector if you can adjust the height to get all of the light into the tank then positioning won't matter because your using all of the available light. The problem comes with our tanks & hoods, the tanks are typically rectangles & the hoods are just that enclosed boxes so if your light goes past the tank your not getting your monies worth, by mounting that particular light as Krish has allows most of the focused light into the tank. Cooling is difficult but you can do it by removing the heat just above the water surface before it hits the water, even though you still have heat higher in the hood.

 

[Krish]

The thing that I think John may be missing as well as a lot of others was the lights aren't really the issue here...Before the lights were ever fired up, my temperature was 86F. I took the canopy off to try and bring it down and it only went as low as 84F. Maybe mounting the lights the other way may help with cooling, but I think my tank just had so much heat locked in it, that it's been taking a while to come down. The reason why I say that is because I didn't change a thing last night with anything and woke up to a temperature of 79.5F, So IMO, if it only budges 0.3 today like it did yesterday, then I'll be under 80F which includes my temperature swing.

 

[fishermann]

Hope your right Krish. I haven't missed that fact. When your temp was at 86 deg. you have changed alot, the most important being taking the back off you cabinet. You were building up heat with nowhere for it to go down there. That was your main issue before adding the MH's, and running a fan down there with the back off well fix most of that. Something that well also help would be to vent your doors so when their closed you still get airflow THROUGH the cabinet. You can do the same by leaving them cracked or adding a way of venting them as I told you what I did. I still haven't put my doors on my new 230 cabinet because I haven't bought any caneing material and have been procrasinaiting {spelling}. I have never had to run a fan on my sump using this method and the way I look at it the less things I have to rely on to keep running the better around saltwater envirement. Guess I learned that from living on a boat for 10 yrs. Back to your lights. Most photo periods run about 10 to 12 hrs with the MH's on and as near as I can tell you haven't had them on near that long. Believe me when I say that they are a large heat source and if not vented right you well overheat your tank. I believe you fixed your pre MH heat issue but now you have them to deal with. I don't run a chiller on my 230 because I didn't want to put a hole in my wall to vent it and they cost alot, so I put a vertical 10'000 btu ac unit in one of the sliders of the picture windows in the living room where the tank sits. I have to keep the roomat about 75 or lower to keeo the tank at 80 or below and this does the trick and cost 350 verses the cost of a chiller big enough to cool a 230 tank and I get to keep cool also instead of just the fish. he-he. Look in my gallery and you well see the 3 pendents are mounted across the tank and things grow just fine and each one of them PFO pentents have a fan built in from the factory on the end with a bunch of louvers on the other end. That brings up another subject { I should learn to quit getting in deeper} you can buy at the same marine store, stainless engine room vents that are louvered instead of just slots and well greatly decrease the light coming through the top of the canopy. If as you say you can run the lights for the whole photo period and the tank doesn't overheat then you should be okay the way you are. Luck

 

[Krish]

Thanks John...I saw the louvered ones here as well, but they scared me I agree with all you said man...And appreciate it again. I run my photoperiod now for 7 hours and before the MH's, I use to run them for 8 hours. I was thinking on shutting off the sump fan to see how much it helps (if any) with keeping the temp down, but I want to leave everything for now as is to see how stable things will be first. I am a person that doesn't like to rely on so many things like all these fans to cool my tank and I told my wife that last night, so I "may" still end up getting a small chiller at some point in time as a backup. If I want my temp to sit constantly at 79F and it is not far from it now, I think by adding in a chiller, it won't have to work very hard at all if ever, but atleast I'd have the security of knowing if something fails, I have backup. We'll see how it goes though...