In Wall - going for it! - seeking your ideas/feedback/advice

[class clown]

Let's decide on Flow...

So.. we've made a couple attempts at trying to define the best flow pattern & parts and I'd like to finalize it. Here's what we've decided on so far.

• Reeflo Hammerhead as the main pump driver
• use schedule 80 parts where possible
• minimize the through the bottom approach b/c of possibility of eventual failure
• two pumps is better than one (if can afford)- doesn't look like will able to for this go around

So... I've made another attempt at a birds eye view to draw the flow diagram. Please let me know what you think.

(8) 3/4" bulkhead outlets
(16) 3 " fan nozzles
(8) Y splitters
(2) 3/4" schedule 80 bulkheads in the middle for the 2 outlets
of the outlets in the rear be mounted half way up.
(2) 1 1/2" durso drain pipes in corners of overflow for return pipes
(2) 1 1/2" schedule 80 bulkheads drain pipes in overflow w/ L bent PVC to come out half way up the side of continuous overflow box for closed loop drains
(4) 3/4" schedule 80 bulkheads in the overflow half way up the side of continuous overflow box for two closed loop outputs. They shoot right through the back, like the return
(2) 1" schedule 80 bulkheads in the overflow towards the bottom of the continuous overflow that shoots right through the back.

 

[class clown]

Here's what the back wall could look like. nice clean & simple.

the two outer upper circles are 3/4" bulkheads, w/ 3/4" locline, y splitter & two 3" flare nozzles

The two outer lower brown circles are (2) 1 1/2" drains for the closed loop. (the drains for the return wouldn't be visable b/c they are contained inside the overflow box)

the middle is a return. It'd be a good idea to do 3/4" locline, y splitter, and 3" flare nozzles on that too right? That's wha I have tried to illustrate here. It's a pressure rated pump, so I don't see why not.

 

[mattseattle]

you put the 2 intakes for the closed loop on the inside of the overflow box? what is your reasoning behind this?

The negatives of this are they can suck in bubbles as well as lower the level in your overflow if not empty it altogether.

 

[dragoneggs]

I am not sure I understand your plumbing setup but I would probably separate my CL from my overflow so it is easier to regulate both the sump and CL separately.

 

[class clown]

Dangit.. nobody understands these silly drawings except me. ha ha.. I need to get some skills in that area - thanks for the hint.

Matt/Mark... So here is what I was thinking for the return of the CL. Yes the hole will be drilled in the bottom of the continuous overflow box. But it will pull water directly out of the tank portion of the tank (not overflow) which means it will be isolated.... any problems with that?

 

[mattseattle]

As long as it's pulling water directly out of the tank and doesn't have any suction in the actual overflow itself i don't see an issue.

 

[class clown]

Here are some side views that I whipped up too so hopefully you can use these compared to the birds eye view up above and it'll make sense.

this view is looking from the viewing pane (front outlets are removed for this picture so you can see the back wall more clearly)

This is the same view, but I just added the front front outlets added in so you can see where they'll hang.

Please tell me this makes sense. Otherwise, I'm going to have to beg rocket to make me another sweet drawing using the CAD program. :badgrin: :badgrin: :badgrin:

 

[class clown]

For such a simple piece of equipment, bulkheads are driving me nuts. It looks like I have 4 types of bulkheads to choose from within the schedule 80 rhealm. What do these acronyms mean? which one's should I choose?

1. Socket x SR FPT
2. FPT x FPT
3. SR FPT x SR FPT
4. Soc x FPT

Here is the quantities and sizes that I think I'll need. Let me know if you see any problems.

Let's start one panel at a time...

The continuous overflow panel is first. For that, I'm thinking I'll be fine with just the regular schedule 40 bulkheads, yes? if one fails, the risk is minimal. for that panel, I'll need:

• 3 of the 3/4" (1 for return, 2 for CL outputs)
• 2 of the 1 1/2" (2 for CL drain)

Next.. the bottom. For anything mounted to the bottom, I know I can't get away with anything less than the schedule 80s. I'll need:

• 2 of the 3/4" schedule 80 bulkheads (2 CL Outputs in main tank bottom)
• 4 of the 1 1/2" schedule 80 for the drains (2 for CL, 2 for dursos)

That should be it for bulkheads right?

 

[Scooterman]

That sure looks like a lots of outlets, you think you really need that many? Just from the 4 on each side that are split inside with loc-line "Y"'s I have water flow like nuts, nothing settles except in the overflow trough & sump. Just looks like a lots, I bet you could eliminate the over the top CL! JM2C$

 

[class clown]

That sure looks like a lots of outlets, you think you really need that many? Just from the 4 on each side that are split inside with loc-line "Y"'s I have water flow like nuts, nothing settles except in the overflow trough & sump. Just looks like a lots, I bet you could eliminate the over the top CL! JM2C$

Really Scooty? see and I was worried about there not being enough. I'm actually relieved you think there are too many. I was particularly worried there wouldn't be enough in front.

Also, for anyone who is interested.. Scooty helped me out with some acronyms offline.. I'm sharing here in case anyone else can benefit....

• FPT = Female Pipe Threads
• MPT is male Pipe threads
• Soc=Socket (smooth(you would use glue for these))
• SR may be Straight Reducer but have to check that one, there are many NPT= "National Pipe Thread" fittings that crosses over to PVC fittings.

So what do you think? Is the FPT x FPT the most typically one that folks choose for these?

 

[Scooterman]

Well If you leave off the over the top Cl, worst case you could just add it later, seems like the design is covering the front but IMO you would get enough reflected water from all the other outlets that you should be very close to having all you would ever need, best thing no PH's!
All of my BH's are FPT x FPT, this way I can thread fittings inside the tank for the Loc-lines & in the back I can either go with a threaded nipple or threaded female adapter. Not that threaded fittings are better than gluing everything, I had my share of leaks on some threads but also on the glued so it basically is a wash. Tight headers like mine requires some gluing experience to get it right the first shot LOL

 

[trido]

I have slip/slip bulkheads in my overflows. I like glue. Also, I can easily pull my dursos out of the bulkhead when I want to give the overflow a quick flush or clean the intakes.
I dont think you have too many locline nozzels at all For a SPS 240 tank. That will allow you to blast the corals that like the high flow and let the rest of the nozzels carry the detrious away. My question is why do you want all fans nozzels? Of course Im a plumbing freak. I have 16 nozzels and two spray bars on my 120G

All this talk about your 240 has my wife talking about a 400G again. If you need help coaxing your wife along, your are both invited to come over to view our built in anytime.

 

[Snowboarda42]

Ben,

You can get metal for the Light Fixture and Stand (If you want to make it from metal) from onlinemetals.com

They're in Ballard and have pretty good prices...

I'll talk to you more about it tomorrow night when I come get my GSP

 

[class clown]

Thanks all for input & Ideas.

My question is why do you want all fans nozzels? [=QUOTE]

shoot - just figured they'd be better. You like the round one's better? I guess you're right, they probably both have their place. When would you use the round one's? how many do you think I should order up of those vs. the flare's? half and half?

also.. am I going to need a pair of these special plyers or can I get away with just a regular pair of plyers?

 

[Scooterman]

Round Nozzles push water in a tighter pattern, the wide ones spread it out a good bit but having both is also good. I got half flairs & just let the others come out straight until I decided if I wanted round of more flares. I never said you had too many Loc-lines, I like splitting them all over the thank, that is a good idea. As far as the pliers I came close to getting them but just pushed them together the hard way It may be a good idea!

 

[trido]

I have the pliers and dont use them. I find they are worthless and just use my hands.
As far as the nozzels, I find that they do both have their place. IMO the round ones do have more of a long distance push across the tank and the flares seem more violent at the opening in a wider pattern but dont have any real distance to the wave maker push that I need. The flares are also larger and more obtrusive at the surface of the tank. A half and half would probably be a good place to start. Or like scooterman said, buy only half or so and fill in the blanks as you need when you figure out whats really necessary.

 

[rocket]

Ben, you im always up for drawing up 3D stuff!

 

[mojoreef]

Ok but if the wide out runs a post instead of a hook I think you would free up the running back for a nice little screen pass


Mike

 

[class clown]

nice Mike.. nice... couldn't help yourself, could ya?

Rocket - I may just call on you to help me out. My drawings make sense to me, but that's b/c I'm drawing them (duhh). I'm trying to get through to Paul at Oceans Motions to ask for his advice too and will let you know if he recomends anything different for flow before asking for your help.

 

[class clown]

Just spent about an hour on the phone w/ Paul at OM. He's a cool guy w/ a lot of knowledge. Turns out I was doing some things right and some things not so right w/ my flow diagram.

Recap of conversation:

• w/ a closed loop, what you're going for is a barreling effect (water rotates from the bottom back of the tank to the front, rolls up at the front, then is pushed back on the surface back towards the overflow)
• My returns have to be at the top of the water column - this was if I have a power outage, my whole entire tank won't drain (duhh - so simple, but something I overlooked)
• scheudle 80s on all bulkheads at bottom of tank = must
• Scheudle 40's good everywhere else -anhything else is overkill
• no need for schedule 80 ball valves - schedule 40 will do
• He thinks I'd be Ok with a Dart vs. a Hammerhead - comparing energy consumtion, they are way more efficient and I'd be just as Ok w/ a dart vs. a hammerhead.
• If I need more flow, he'd recomend doubling up on the darts - 1 could be continuous on, the other w/ the OM.
• He recomends 4 outlets on the bottom. one in 4 corners. If I need more flow, then double up.
• Doesn't think I need anything in the channel - but I could add a omniflex splitter to channel it both on the inside and outside of the rock islands
• Having rock work suspended/lifted up on those pegs is excellent for barreling effect
  
• Redundant drains are good for CL 1 1/2" is good, but need to figure out a way so that it pulls water from close to the surface so that it enhances the barreling effect.

Ok.. so back to the drawing board.. stay tuned...